It is tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail. – Abraham Maslow
The principle known as “Maslow’s Hammer” due to its popularization by psychologist Abraham Maslow in his 1966 The Psychology of Science actually first appeared in 1964 in the writings of the philosopher Abraham Kaplan; he called it “The Law of the Instrument” and stated it as “Give a small boy a hammer, and he will find that everything he encounters needs pounding.” One year ago today I wrote about the way that the neofeminist/Christian campaign against sexual freedom has been disguised by a revival of the century-old “white slavery” hysteria; in order to drum up public fervor against a victimless crime, prohibitionists found it necessary to define all prostitutes as victims. And having defined everything as a nail and released a squad of goons whose only tool is brute force, we shouldn’t be terribly surprised if the result is an awful lot of pounding.
The following is edited from an August 9th article on the CNN Hammer Project:
“Hello? Hey, what are you doing, girl? You just woke up? You going to be free to hang out in a little bit?” Shane, a vice unit undercover investigator, is on the phone with a woman who placed an online ad offering adult services. “Okay I’m going to head down to the Disneyland area and get a hotel.” He’s making a date, and choosing his words carefully. “I just want to make sure I get what I need. Are you bringing condoms or do I need to bring condoms? You’ve got some? And it’s 200 for an hour right?” Shane has become an expert at scoring that important criminal admission over the phone – making sure there is no confusion that sex is expected on this date. “From what I found, sometimes you can use too much jargon,” Shane explained. “If you use too many street terms you can come off like a cop so I almost talk to them like, “Hey this is what I’m looking for” – just common terms and maybe throw in just a little bit of street jargon. “If you call them rude or real vulgar they’ll just hang up on you. So, to them it’s a business and they run it like it’s a business, so there’s that fine dance you have to do with them in negotiation you have to play to get the deal to work.”
I felt like I had to take a shower after reading this. Note the use of condoms as evidence, flying in the face of every principle of public health; the ridiculous idea that escorts will respond well to “street jargon” (in fact, most hate and barely tolerate it) and the twisted logic of recognizing that escorts are businesswomen while treating them like criminals and then pretending that they’re victims:
This is the first step in a human trafficking operation by the vice unit. Next, the team will wait for Shane’s date at a local hotel, hoping to eventually grab the date’s pimp.
Because, of course, all independent escorts MUST have pimps, and they’ll try to find a driver or boyfriend they can hang the label on; the hammer needs a nail.
Shane works for Anaheim Police Department – one of a raft of agencies that make up the Orange County Human Trafficking Task Force or OCHTTF…In recent months, the fight against prostitution has been refocused and now the prostitutes are treated as victims. “It’s not knocking what we did before,” explained Sergeant Craig Friesen, head of Anaheim’s vice unit. “You’d go out, arrest the girls, you do John stings, you arrest the Johns, but with those arrests they’re often low-grade misdemeanor arrests where the people either receive a very minimal sentence or they’re released, oftentimes working in the street 24 hours later. “With us changing our focus to trying to arrest the pimps, pimping carries a three year mandatory sentence here in California, so to us we have more of an impact because if we can arrest one pimp we can in theory shut down three or four girls because if their pimp’s out, it gives them the opportunity to escape the life that they’re in.”
Are these people actually capable of higher-level cognitive functions? They specifically target online escorts, but then vomit out this puerile “pimp and ho” garbage about “walking the street” and “escaping the life they’re in”. It’s as though they just mixed up a bunch of ignorant stereotypes without any regard for whether the results make sense and served the results to CNN.
The Orange County task force is one of 42 federally funded human trafficking task forces across the United States. Many agencies are part of the task force – from local police departments like Anaheim and Westminster, to federal agencies like ICE and the IRS, which help with immigration and translation issues. The FBI lends agents to the task force, and one agent frequently works with Anaheim’s vice unit via the FBI’s domestic child sex trafficking task force known as Innocence Lost.
By this clever shell game, federal funds are illegally diverted (there is no federal prostitution law) to local agencies; when private corporations do this it’s called “money laundering” and it’s a serious felony.
…“I think what I’m struck most by is the similarity between the stories,” said Heidi Thi, the supervisor of the human trafficking program at CSP. “I could have somebody who was sold as a child in China and brought here to Orange County to work as a slave in somebody’s house, or I could be talking to a domestic minor who’s been trafficked for sex who was from Northern California and was down here in Orange County – and it’s striking how similar those stories can be”…Anaheim is the task force’s newest member, and only nine months after receiving federal human trafficking grant money, the team has seen great success. Sergeant Friesen said the original goal was one pimping arrest in the first year. The arrest from Shane’s date was the 13th in the first nine months. He added: “Once we started looking for it – and almost stopped ignoring it – we started finding it everywhere.”
In other words, Heidi has a hammer and is struck by the fact that everything looks like a nail to her. And once Sergeant Friesen was issued his shiny new federal hammer, he “started finding [nails] everywhere.” If you’ve read this far, I’m sure you’re not a bit surprised.
All I’m going to say is … that’s California for ya!
No wonder they’re going broke, huh? I tell you, reading this is like reading something out of the middle ages – this blind belief that they are actually helping people in spite of the evidence to the contrary right in front of their faces.
You know, the biggest problem anyone has when working for government today, any government, is making yourself “bulletproof” to the “groupthink”. I just got into this with a bunch of my Command Master Chief friends in the Navy, who all gave a big “thumbs up” to destroying the career of the Captain of the USS ENTERPRISE – for some “racey” educational videos he did when he was the Executive Officer there. All of my buddies are “locked” into that Navy groupthink that anything that approaches the sexual, no matter how entertaining – is somehow worse than Satan himself.
And – you got it here in spades with these “Human Trafficking Divisions”. But hey, if you’re going to have “minions” you have to make sure they buy into the propaganda that what they are doing is actually useful to society.
Sad.
Damn it … I should not have gotten out of bed this morning …
Just read THIS now …
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111904787404576530520471223268.html
This makes me want to say the “F-word” over and over.
I see two problems here, and neither of them is environmental law.
1) Asset forfeiture. We’ve talked about it here before; it gives the government a financial incentive to harass people who may be innocent… even if the agents know that the target is innocent. They can take that guitar, replace the offending ivory headstock nut with one made of bone,* then sell the guitar for loads of money.
2) Burden of proof problems. According to the US Constitution (anybody remember that?), I don’t have to prove beyond all almost-reasonable doubt that my guitar doesn’t contain Madagascar ebony; the Feds have to prove that it does. But with asset forfeiture you get idiocy like “United States of America v. Ebony Wood in Various Forms,” and hardwoods don’t have the rights that people do. Hardwoods aren’t innocent until proven guilty.
* And because of 2) they can often do this even if the headstock nut was made of polyethylene.
Yeah I agree with you on all of that! It’s just amazing to me that this nation didn’t go broke a half century ago when we’re been funding law enforcement to do these silly-assed things.
If law enforcement is clever with the asset forfeiture, they can more than make up the cost of the raids and such. They can actually do more with less tax money. Then the mayor or governor or senator or whoever can boast of his tough-on-crime cop shot while also keeping taxes down.
And if there’s one thing Americans love, it’s a hot-fudge sundae diet.
EAT ALL THE HOT-FUDGE SUNDAES YOU WANT, AND STILL LOSE WEIGHT!
HAVE ALL THE CRIME-BUSTING, LOCK ‘EM UP AND THROW AWAY THE KEY TOUGHNESS YOU WANT, AND NO NEW TAXES!
The authorities tend to bypass the Constitution by charging inanimate objects with a crime — like the way they seize cars in prostitution busts. An inanimate object has no rights.
It’s insane. That may have made sense when they were going after 18th century smugglers. But it’s fricking 2011, gus!
http://www.redstate.com/aglanon/2011/08/25/doj-raids-gibson-guitars-looking-for-illegal-wood/
When I first saw this, I was wondering if it was a federal anti-prostitution sting targeting the male clients.
But seriously, the feds have been targeting firearms like this since the mid 70’s. If you have an old S&W with an ivory bead for the front sight, they can confiscate it if you can’t provide provenance. Same for ivory handled revolvers. And that’s just when they’re using the endangered species blackjack let alone all the GCA 68, McClure 86, Bush 40’s import ban and all the rest.
“First they came for the Harlots; I said nothing because I was not a Harlot.
Then they came for the Musicians; I kept silent because I was not a Musician.”
And y’all know how the meme ends.
Badly for Freedom. :/
God, that Shane literally radiates sleaze even through the writing. How easy is it for escorts to avoid stings like the one Shane’s arranging?
Any experienced escort would hang up the second he said “condom”; only cops and ignoramuses talk about that sort of thing on the phone. Unfortunately, cops are scum and scum have instinct; like animals, they can sense weak prey (in this case, young and inexperienced escorts who really should be working for agencies until they learn the ropes) and target them for victimization.
Speaking of which, have you ever written a column about independents and agency escorts? I mean, it’s always made sense to me that, if a gal had good business senses that she’d do better on her own as an indie rather than forking over the agency fee for every transaction.
You were part owner of the agency you worked in, right?
I don’t know – but most of the advice amognst us “guys” is that a reputable indie will normally be a better experience because she works for herself. Of course – I just know you’re going to explode that myth for me – just as you always do!!!!!!
It’s not a matter of business sense; it’s a matter of whether a girl is greedier or lazier. If she’s greedier than she is lazy, she’s better off as an independent; if she’s lazier than she is greedy, she’s better off with an agency. The internet changed everything; girls used to make far more money, and were far safer, working with agencies, but the internet made good ads dirt cheap and allowed girls to do screening.
You realize that comparing reputable indies with random agencies (rather than reputable vs. reputable or all vs. all) is apples and oranges, right?
Oh yeah I realize that, only said “reputable” for the independents because, statistically – there are probably more “indies” than escort agencies and thus – far more “scams” in the “indie” world.
And when he talked about her rate, when it was obviously in her advertisement in the first place.
No, no these people do not have many higher brain functions and they will continue to lack them so long as the public-at-large don’t hold them to a higher standard.
now the prostitutes are treated as victims. “It’s not knocking what we did before,” explained Sergeant Craig Friesen, head of Anaheim’s vice unit. ”You’d go out, arrest the girls…“
Redefining prostitutes from criminals to victims, while claiming that both approaches are correct at the same time, makes sense in Sergeant Friesen’s head because he’s not burdened with elementary logic.
Maggie, I’m glad you wrote this article.We both know the real reason why prostitution is illegal in the USA except for a few counties in Nevada. It is illegal because most women hate the competition prostitution brings to women in general and each woman specifically. Let me pause here to say to be sex partners for women in their desirability are either Alpha( most wanted by women), Beta(somewhat wanted by women) or Omega(very seldom if ever wanted by women) in category. Alpha males are known by first by their social savvy with women, second their social dominance especially with women, and finally their good looks. If these Alpha men have money, power and fame, it puts these characteristics on virtual steriods. A Paper Alpha is someone who has money, power and fame, but not the social savvy with women nor the social dominance over women, and if these men aren’t careful, they can be tooled by unscrupulous women. Most American women to one degree or another think it’s cute to denigrate, belittle and shame the Beta and Omega males as well as denigrate, belittle and shame the prostitutes who provide relief to such said males. On occasion when the Alpha males get caught because of lack of self restraint and being unlucky when they are customers in prostitution, most of the ladies think it’s dandy to bring them down too, but Alpha males are less likely to be punished as severely as Beta and Omega males by the women, but may or may not be punished more by their competitor males be they better, similar or worse competitors for the ladies attention. Most women have no idea how difficult it is even for the overwhelming majority of Alpha males to get women to have sex with them even in this promiscuous age. An even higher percentage of women have no idea on how much more difficult it is for the beta and the omega males, and even if they did, they couldn’t have a care in the world for these men nor for the prostitutes who service them. Women also hate the prostitutes and strippers because on average these women are much better looking than the women who were never prostitutes nor strippers whom they know can out-compete them; and, the same could be said of former prostitutes and strippers who are opposed to legalized, taxed and well regulated prostitution and stripping. They could hide behind their notions of reducing venerial disease, or upholding morals such as strengthening marriage or ridding child prostitution or helping the prostitute from her harsh life, but as has been pointed out before legalized well regulated prostitution reduces venerial disease and child prostitution and most prostitutes are not emotional competitors for men’s attention even though they may be financial competitors, but a mistress is both a financial and emotional competitor to marriage. Prostitutes may also agree to sexual practices that even Alpha men much less lower ranked men would even ask for and less likely to get compliance from women to do such as two women having sex with one man etc.which most women also hate. It is much easier for any women to get two men into bed with her even without paying one cent for it than it is for a man is the corrallary. Where prostitution is legal child prostitution is more rare, and the prostitutes are even less likely to have venerial diseases than the non prostitutes. Anti-prostitution also affects what kind of women that men are willing to sleep with and even marry or stay married to on average which I assure you is the women being a lot nastier in every respect than what pro-prostitution does. Prostitution tends to encourage men to walk away from nasty and dodgy relationships with women which is also why women are against prostitution. Joined with adultry laws not being grounds for fault divorce in almost half the states, no fault divorce and spouses having no legal right to demand sex from their wives tends to make men tolerate even worse behavior from their wives when they can’t have prostitutes too. Most women seem to think that all men have it easier because they only look at the lives of the Alpha men and not the Beta and Omega men who usually have life just as bad if not worse than women.
The men who are against prostitution fall into one of two categories.The first category is the majority of these men. Most are like the Stockholm victims who identify and support their captors who were brutally victimizing them before. They are also more likely at least when it comes to prostitution think like your typical woman, and even to some degree in other areas as well be more like a woman than the pro-prostitution especially pro-legalized prostitution men on average. Even if they would never engage in prostitution themselves, they fail to put themselves in another man’s shoes and say if it doesn’t effect me, it’s none of my business and I have no right to another man’s pursuit of happiness. They also fail to see that men who visit prostitutes are less likely to try to seduce another man’s wife, daughter sister, mother etc. I call these men MANGINAS, and regretttably many of these men are in power. These manginas are happy to do women’s bidding for a pat on the head like the mentally castrated boy dog pets they are. The second group are the Alpha males who have the money, power and fame to change things even knowing that anti-prostitution laws are wrong, but they don’t care. Like the powerful manginas, they get all the sex from the women they want because women will line up for them and if they want they can have virtual harems of women with a loyal wife and several mistresses. The difference between the knowing man in power and the Mangina in power is that the knowing man knows better and simply refuses to do better for his fellow man and even for his fellow women and children. This is all a ploy to destroy their Alpha male competitors if caught and to keep the beta and omega men down. Women happily support this program and these men because rabid feminism has taught them that maybe Alpha men and certainly Beta and Omega men aren’t fully real human beings with needs and desires. It’s all about controling the beta and omega men who are always the majority to one degree or another while the ruling elite men get their virtual cheap harem.
These fools never realize that without the support of law abiding beta and omega men providing for and protecting the women and Alpha men and ruling elite, there lives would be worse. Civilization, material comfort and security would disappear without these men. The most important thing any civilization could do is to empower such men because if treated like slaves and non-humans, they will at best passively do nothing but let things fall apart and at worst will either alone or organized into groups tear things and people apart piece by piece. BIG BROTHER ELITE AND GOVERNMENT, I want peace not destruction and this is why I made this long commentary.
Wrong again, doclove. Wrong again.
I meant to say above that many men including Alpha, Beta, and Omega men wouldn’t think to ask for some sexual practices from their girlfriends such as getting two women to have sex with them at the same time for many reasons such as embarrassment, non compliance from the women in their lives and the notion it might ruin the relationship etc.I want to add that just because one finds something immoral does not imply it should also be illegal. So just because prostitution is immoral by Christian standards, does not mean it should be illegal by man’s law. Prostitution should be legalized and properly regulated. Even greater religous Christian thinkers than you(whoever reads this) and I such as St. Thomas Aquinas and St. Augustine of Hippo thought so.
I really don’t like to ascribe “evil intentions” to stupid actions by humans. Normally, I think stupidity is a product of ignorance.
Women who are against prostitution are the “straight women” who do not know that men REALLY do separate sex from love. We don’t feel the same about it as they do. For instance, I could sleep with a hundred women at this point for sex and still be every bit as devoted and attracted to my wife – but only if those hundred women were prostitutes.
If they’re not … then they are women looking to attach themselves to males and that kind of woman is far more dangerous to a marriage than a prostitute is. If your wife catches you in an affair with another woman – she’s going to ask “Are you in love with her?” This seems to make a lot of difference to women. They’re also going to wonder if the other woman is in love with their man.
With a prostitute – is a woman really going to ask if you’re in love with her? Is she really going to wonder if the prostitute is in love with you?
But, a prostitute does bring up other questions … like … “my husband’s a pervert” and “I can’t believe he took the risk of catching STD’s and giving them to me!” Prostitutes are still considered “diseased” and “dirty” by a lot of straight women.
Soooo … there is some education that needs to take place here.
And by the way – I don’t think just “beta” and “omega” males, as you describe them – seek the services of prostitutes. Any smart Alpha guy is going to do it also, if he’s in a committed relationship. I had an affair once … and fell in love with the girl, and momentarily fell out of love with my wife. I was almost ready to chuck my entire life and my kids in the process. Fortunately, both of us in the affair came to our senses and got out of the relationship.
And I think back on that and think … “Damn, I almost left my best friend” … I’m sure glad I got out of that affair cleanly.
It all comes down to “strange” anyway – the male drive for variety. It’ll push the hormones it needs to in order to get you to stray – even going as far as making you think you “love” another woman.
Hookers? It’s the “strange” without the baggage of an affair. It’s straight up and honest. Now … you say that some women are intimidated by hookers doing things for their husbands that the wife doesn’t do. And I say – no woman should fear that. If a guy wants to do something with his wife, he’ll ask her. For instance, I would not particularly want a “threesome” with my wife included – because, I don’t think she’s in to chicks (sigh). But anyway – a guy could get that fantasy satisfied with a couple of hookers and everyone is happy! 😛
I really don’t like to ascribe “evil intentions” to stupid actions by humans. Normally, I think stupidity is a product of ignorance.
Why not, the long I live the more obvious it seems to me. And the way I see it ignorance is a lack of knowlegde, nothing to be ashamed of – assuming one is willing to learn. I see stupidity as a willful rejection of knowledge.
“Women who are against prostitution are the “straight women” who do not know that men REALLY do separate sex from love”-really? This doesn’t apply in at least a few cases and I’m 1 of those cases. Something I’ve always wondered: those of you who claim to know all the reasons some women hate prostitution (I do, but am FOR decriminalization) how much effort have you put into ACTUALLY ASKING the women who are against it the reasons why they are? Many would ASS-ume I’m against it for me mainly or wholly because I’m a Christian. Not completely true. I’m against it for me for at least a few reasons. Also, there’s women who can have sex without emotional attachment. I’m 1 of these. Whores do this also. Whores AREN’T the ONLY women who do this. This is something that I’m going to be pointing out every chance I get. Also pointing out that not all non-whore women are going to ruin your relationship, etc. We’re not all looking for an affair. I never did and did things a certain way to avoid that. I’m very thankful that no one I was with ever tried to break up my relationship that I had with my fiance (INCLUDING the few women I was with). But, I thought all we non-whore women are “trouble” (eyeroll), want affairs, want to split couples up, etc.? RIGHT! I never did and never will. There’s others besides me and they need to be mentioned as much as possible because if we don’t speak up many will think we don’t exist at all which is what some want unfortunately.
[blockquote]But, I thought all we non-whore women are “trouble” (eyeroll), want affairs, want to split couples up, etc.?
– emphasis added[/blockquote]
I don’t think anybody has been so all-inclusive. It’s just that the odds of running into a home-wrecker are higher when the woman a man chooses isn’t doing it for money, because she might (MIGHT!) be doing it to find a relationship. Doesn’t mean all of them are, but the odds are higher.
To anyone who didn’t read my previous comment on another of Maggie’s post, I agreed with St. Thomas Aquinas and St. Augustine of Hippo that engaging in prostitution either as a customer or as a prostitute is an offense against God, but it should never be outlawed, and I say this as Christian and fellow Cathoilc with these great men and religous philosophers..
Dear doclove, you can be a Christian and FOR decriminalization of prostitution. I’m 1 of these people. It’s 1 of the many reasons I started posting here: to BREAK the stereotype that ALL or even MOST Christians are literally ordering whores around telling them to stop what they’re doing. Other ###*** about us Christians in this area: when we’re not ordering whores to stop we’re joining every group we can that are also ordering the whores around and want prostitution criminalized forever. We join any neofeminist group we can also. We also want ALL people to stop having sex AT ALL even within marriage. RIGHT! That’s 1 of the biggest “howlers” to me. I love how when this ###*** is said the many Christians like me who don’t order anyone around are NEVER mentioned. That’s on purpose for many reasons. The truth is there’s many in this world who choose to be conservative in the sexual area (not just Christians, but those “horrible” (eyeroll) Muslims also along with those in other belief systems) and don’t order anyone around, aren’t part of any of the groups I mentioned above, don’t WANT political power (I’m also in that group) and see there’s a lot more important work for them to do than order whores around, etc. There’s people to HELP instead who are in crisis situations whether it’s not having enough food, clothes, etc., or need support from a crisis they’re in that they had nothing to do with causing. You CAN hate prostitution for YOURSELF (I do), but also want decriminalization. You don’t have to be part of that system, but can be for letting those who want to be have the freedom to do so. The sick truth is there are people of different belief systems who do order whores around, etc. BUT, there’s also many who DON’T. I get so tired of the CONSTANT NEGATIVITY. The Christians and others who don’t do these things are willfully ignored and willfully not talked about. It’s the same ###*** as saying all the prosecutors are evil, don’t care, only care about winning cases for their egos, etc. RIGHT! There are MANY who really do care, really do work for justice and accomplish this. They also don’t care only about the # of cases they win, etc., as just an ego thing. I know this from 1st hand experience as do MANY others I’ve run into online and off, have read about, etc. Thanks for listening.
Let me also say that men especially Beta men and even omega men will work hard, provide for and defend not only their own wives and daughters, but other men’s wives, daughters and other women as well as try to be good fathers if they are able to have happy stable loving relationships and satisfying sex lives with women. Without these things, men are more likely to let civilization fall apart by being passive aggressive at best and at worst will destroy everything in their path at worst. Trying to humiliate, denigrate, shame and enslave men will not work and will backfire. These days marriage is a fool’s errand for men because it simulates but is not technically slavery for men due to no fault divorce and the wife getting the children, home, child support payments most of the time even if the man has commited no wrong and she is the one to file for divorce first. Women file for divorce 70% of the time in the USA. Prostitution and pornography when legalized and well regulated(not stupidly or overly regulated) provides a safety valve for society and civilization as well because men are less likely to do stupid things when there is this safety valve for them to blow off steam and their sexual desires are met. Sexual desire may not be a need, but it is dangerously close to being a need and only a fool would believe otherwise so it is best not to frustrate anyone’s pursuit of happiness which includes sexual desire. What two consenting adults decide to do behind closed doors should be noone’s business, and this is why prostitution should be legalized.
@ Krulac
I agree that most people are ignorant or even stupid bafoons about this issue, but some are truly evil because they know anti-prostitution human laws are wrong. In previous posts which I can’t remember much less locate, Maggie stated that most American men don’t know what women want and need nor how to give it to them, but they really do want to know what women want and need and give it to them However most American women today don’t know what men want and need, nor do they care to know much less give it to them especially if they are under age 50 according to what I read Maggie writing. There are other websites saying the same thing. The reason for this is what I call rabid feminism and what Maggie calls neofeminism not sensible feminism.
@ Krulac
I also agree that even Alpha men will engage in prostitution. However as you say, they will do so usually to keep a happy relationship with their girlfriend or wife.Alpha men may avoid mistresses and use prostitutes to save their romantic relationships with the women in their lives. Other men may try to ruin the Alpha men if he is caught with prostitutes. Beta men often do not have the ability to attract other women other than their girlfriend or wife. Omega men have even less ability than beta men to attract women. Women have this tendency to want the men that other women want. This tendency is no where near as prevalent among men which means that men really don’t want a women because other men want her. What men consider attractive in looks is much more hardwired than it is for women. Sure, each man has different tastes in what he finds physically attractive, but men are still mostly hardwired to find physically attractive women atrractive regardless of what other men think. Men are also more likely to see a stranger woman as physically attractive than a woman is to see a stranger man as attractive. On a previous post, I stated that from a study I read off the internet, both college aged men and women looked at pictures of the opposite sex who were also college aged and who they did not know. Men thought 80% of the Women were physically attractive and Women thought only 25% of the men were physically attractive. The problem with Beta men is they are less likely to have the Social Savvy and Social Dominance with women that the Alpha men have. Omega men have even less than beta men. What women find attractive is a man who knows how to carry himself and speak well when a man tries to initially seduce a woman, and we all know physically ugly men who know how to seduce many physically beautiful women and even restrained moral women who would have never had sex with other men so easily. We also know of physically handsome men who lack the social skills to have relationships and sex with women or they more likely have poor relationships with women or even relationships with women who aren’t as physically attractive as they are. Looks aren’t as important to women in the initial attraction, but social savvy is much more important to women in the initial attraction. Prostitution can let an Alpha man manage his relationships more effectively in a good way, and it allows access to more and better sex for the beta and especially the omega men because if you as a man can’t attract a woman no matter how much of a good guy you are, you aren’t getting sex, and in this way prostitution allows the beta and omega men to sex they would have never had otherwise.
When prostitution is legal, it is safer for the prostitutes. They are safer from crime, criminal record and venerial disease. They are also more likely to be professional and possibly make a higher “legitimate” living and pay taxes.Pimps are less likely to be around too.
I find it difficult to believe that prostitutes could be any safer from venereal disease than we already are; it’s amateurs who seem to be in need of a legal structure in order to reduce the rate of disease. Pimps are so fabulously rare already that I can’t imagine how giving them licenses could make them any scarcer; if anything it would be the opposite. Furthermore, when prostitution is legal most girls make less money, not more, and professionalism is also independent of legality. There are only two advantages to decriminalization, but both are important: 1) Whores are freed of police harassment, persecution and rape, and 2) they are able to report crimes committed against them just like others can. Every other advantage of decriminalization is enjoyed by the clients and society in general, not the prostitutes.
“…it’s amateurs who seem to be in need of a legal structure in order to reduce the rate of disease”…am curious what exactly is meant by this? I want to stand up once again for the non-whore women like me who have never had an STD and DO practice safe sex. I’ve admitted on here that a few times in the past when I had sex only friendships I didn’t use condoms. BUT, that’s never happened again and never will. It was completely my fault and was tied in with the self-destruction of PAST alcoholism. It also needs to be pointed out that I always DID have condoms with me and paid all costs for them. Not 1 man I met ever objected to using 1. I see there’s a need (unfortunately) for me and the other non-whore women to speak up in defense of ourselves on this issue. I’ll keep speaking up on this until I’m dead like I do on other issues.
Laura, you should’ve noticed by now that I’m never in favor of government forcing any individual to do anything for which personal responsibility will suffice. However, if anybody is going to be restricted for supposedly spreading disease, shouldn’t it logically be the group which is actually spreading it rather than a group that isn’t?
Again, I think by now everybody here knows that you aren’t an STD Typhoid Mary. She wasn’t talking about you. But what YOU are doing right doesn’t change the fact that many others are NOT doing right.
Are we supposed to ignore the fact that, AS A GROUP, non-prostitute promiscuous people (male and female) are spreading more disease than prostitutes AS A GROUP are? Does anybody who mentions this FACT have to add another hundred words or so, just to make sure we all know that yes, there are some who do not (even though we DO already know this)?
Dear Sailor B, here we go again…beats head against wall. I’ll say it again: I’m defending we non-whore women every chance I get, OK? It’s VERY NEEDED. When I do this it doesn’t automatically mean I think everyone is talking about me specifically. It’s the same as when I vent about the MVS and you think it’s against YOU because you happen to be around when I’m venting. The positives need to be mentioned because the negatives are CONSTANTLY mentioned. Yes, I acknowledge the disease rate. But, does that mean I should just shut up and not mention the 1’s like me who DON’T fit this? In other words, A POSITIVE? I won’t be any part of the EVIL MENTALITY that small groups and individuals don’t count. That’s what the world system wants of us: to say exceptions, small groups and individuals don’t count and just SHUT UP AND GO AWAY. Many want the MVS to shut up and go away OR just see us as a form of ghoulish entertainment. NEVER! I’m fighting it and speaking out against it until I’m dead. It’s the same with defending the non-whore women now with me.
But Laura, WE ALL KNOW THIS.
Dear Sailor B, we also know other things that have been repeated many times that I haven’t written on here. I don’t see that as a problem either. Is there some “set #” of times you can state stuff? When you’re speaking up to educate on ANY issue repitition is part of that. An example: on the issue of the death penalty those for and against it post statistics, their personal experiences with those affected by DP, etc., 100’s of times over the years. Or speak them 100’s of times in person. I say WONDERFUL. They won’t give up which INCLUDES shutting up. I’ve learned about whores on here and part of that was from Maggie and others saying some things about them repeatedly. Sometimes it takes a lot of educating to get you to at least think about stuff. I know it’s been that way with me about whores. I’m not the only 1 who repeats stuff on here and I think those people have the right to do so also. Thanks for listening.
I’m closer to you than I am to the other people on this blog. Perhaps I see these things with you more than is fair.
When I was married, and my ex and I would get into discussions about sex, or women in general whatever we were talking about would never really apply to me because I was more of a whore than a woman so he would say “your a bad example”
I am telling you those same words now Laura. Yes, we know, you are a pro bono whore so to speak, or a wild woman as you call it. Either way, you are a bad example of a non whore female, because your mentality is more closely approximated to that of the whore.
You like to try to discount what clearly applies to non professional women, but you being the exception to the rule does not eliminate the rule, and you yourself should acknowledge that there is in fact a rule that you are an exception to, much like I was the exception the the rule most of the time when talking about wives, and non pro women.
Dear nymphtalk, many times on here I’ve said that the whores and non-whores should work towards as much understanding as possible: to acknowledge what we have in common and at least try to understand each other. Like I said just now to Sailor Barsoom, a big part of my life is pointing out the POSITIVES. If no one points out the exceptions, the small groups, the individuals then how much worse will things be? They’ll be worse than they are. I want to fight the constant negativity about certain groups. Yes, I acknowledge these disease rate statistics. But, I won’t just shut up and go away and not point out that there ARE non-whore women (like me) who have never had an STD and make no exceptions on practicing safe sex. I’ve admitted a few times in the past I didn’t use condoms. This was completely my fault. But, it hasn’t happened again and never will. Again, I’m pointing out the positives. I’m curious: if someone says to you all or at least most of the whores are on drugs do you not answer that charge? Do you just accept it? Or do you defend the 1’s who aren’t on drugs? Before any screaming starts, I’m not saying by this question most and/or all of them are on drugs. What about if someone brings up a negative statistic about whores that IS true? Will you keep quiet OR will you bring up the 1’s who DON’T fit that statistic? I’m going to keep saying I’m a wild woman because I resolved years ago that 1 day I would come out and not hide it anymore from anyone. I did the mental/emotional work to get to that goal. This group of women deserve to repeatedly say what they are, why they do things the way they do, etc., as much as whores do. There’s room for EVERYONE. Any website that just pushes 1 side of an issue is not only boring, but also not giving all the information out there. An example: a death penalty website with just those who are for the DP on it. There’s many people who are looking to get all the information they can on DP (I was 1 of these) and they get the most help from websites that have ALL views on the issue. Thanks for listening.
This is the most revealing part:
In other words, it’s conviction stats. They don’t want to arrest the girls because they don’t get good stats. Also telling that they expect 1 pimping arrest in the first year. They spend all day calling girls and arranging dates and they can find one pimp per year! That’s all?! That’s practically an admission that this is a small problem.
I don’t object to getting people who are legitimating enslaving people. But, dammit, it would be much easier to do that if you decriminalized it for adults. Signal-to-noise guys.
Maggie, what do they do to girls who don’t have a pimp?
The number of escorts who have pimps is so small it almost can’t be measured, and since (according to this story) it’s escorts they’re targeting I expect they try to trick and/or pressure the girls into pointing a finger at someone. They also arrest drivers, husbands, boyfriends, male roommates or whatever and charge them with “pimping” or “human trafficking”, thus forcing the girl to deplete her savings to pay his bail and hire a lawyer (which can be very expensive for federal charges). I expect that if this goes on long enough and they get frustrated enough at their inability to produce nonexistent pimps, they’ll invent nuisance charges with which to threaten the girls or else lock them up in “rehabilitation centers” to “cure” them of the “Stockholm syndrome” they must be suffering from because they refuse to lie about their husbands or boyfriends in order to save their own hides. That’s what a cop would do under the circumstances, so they think there’s something wrong with anyone who has principles and loyalty.
@ Krulac
I also agree that most women do not fully know nor understand that men’s sexual desire is by far more seperated from romantic love than it is for women. However, most men do know and understand this. Most women also aren’t wise enough to realise that men going to prostitutes isn’t as perverted as they might think, but most men do know. The tendency for both men and women in america is to shame these men who visit prostitutes as men who couldn’t get a woman unless they payed for it or as sexual deviants. Most of these men are not deviant, they are simply not getting their desires met. Some of these men may not be able to get sex with a woman unless they pay for it, but why should they be made into criminals with unjustified belittlement, denigrattion and shame. Then again, for men who could get sex from women other than prostitutes, one could say the same as to why all the negativity is directed at them. The problem is as even religous Christian scholar men of yore noted, if we do not allow prostitution, men on average will start treating all women including wives, maidens and widows as contemtible worthy of abuse and no respect people and as sluts and whores. Men these days certainly do that these days more than in the past and although it isn’t the only reason, lack of legalized prostitution is certainly one of them. What many women and even worse men fail to realize is that legalized prostitution joined with stable happy marriages, and respect for men makes men nicer and more respectful to most women. When you strip one or all of these away as our civilization has done men become more uncaring to women and even meaner and less respectful to women. Who do you think has more respect for women—Persian Gulf/Iraq/Afghanistan War male veterans or World War2/Korean/Vietnam male War veterans? The latter group does because men were more respected then, more likely to have a happy stable marriage and were more likely to have access to prostitutes without the idiotic interference from the military to boot in these men’s sex lives with prostitutes.
@ Krulac
By the way, I’m a 43 year old man, was in the U.S. Army for eight years, and am an Afghanistan and Iraq Wars veteran.
Anti-prostitution laws are simply about one person telling another person how he or she should live and are fundamentally against liberty.
@ Maggie McNeill
I agree with your response to me. My over all point with my commentaries is that legalizing prostitution would be overall be better for the prostitutes because the prostitutes would be clear of criminal records and police harrassment as well as be less likely to be victims of crimes even though it might mean less money for the prostitutes. I also know that Nevada and Amsterdam prostitutes where prostitution have significantly lower venereal disease rates than the general population for example, I wrote the above commentaries to show how society at large would benefit if prostitution were legalized. Cops, the prosecution and the courts would be able to concentrate more time and money on REAL CRIMES. for example. Men would certainly and directly benefit a lot and even women who were never prostitutes would indirectly benefit. That is all I tried to say. Sadly most people are either too ignorant or willfully stupid to know and do better. Some people are truly evil and enjoy making others suffer. Any way you look at it being against legalized prostitution is against liberty and controling others. One would have a difficult time trying to convince me that if a person isn’t physically harmed nor unjustly have his reputation destroyed, nor property destroyed nor property stolen, that something is a TRUE CRIME. I do have a conservative libertarian streak, and like Ron Paul the most out of all the Presidential Candidates even though I may not 100% agree with him on everything.
Prostitutes EVERYWHERE have significantly lower venereal disease rates than the general population, whether it’s legal or not; it’s because we take precautions, not because those precautions are forced on us by government.
Dear doclove, it’s great to see a fellow Ron Paul fan! He’s 1 of the few politicians I support and while I don’t agree with him on everything either he’s proven himself over the years in at least a few ways.
@ Maggie McNeill
I meant to say that I’ve known for a long time that where prostitution is legal such as Nevada and Amsterdam, venereal disease is significantly less common than among the general population. I also believe you that at least among call girls this may be true too even where it is illegal. While I’m here, your writings seem to indicate that you are significantly smarter, sane and logical and even compassionate than most women I’ve known. I could even say the same to a lesser degree when you are compared to most men I’ve known. Your insight about men and compassion for men is very high which, is sadly lacking among most of the women and even too many men I’ve known in my lifetime. Sadly, most people of either sex lack the insight and compassion for prostitutes and their customers that we have. I can see why women would be against prostitution, prostitutes and customers in general and legalized prostitution specifically even though I disagree with them and am right having better and more valid reasons. I just look at men who are against prostitution, prostitutes and their customers as idiotic MANGINAS.I could care less if they could beat me to a bloody pulp because, these men as far as I’m concerned don’t think, act nor have feelings like real men. I can understand these men being personally opposed to visiting prostitutes themselves, but as to what another man does in regards to prostitution should be none of their business and as a rule not looked down upon if it doesn’t affect them, their family or friends which it seldom if ever does.
@ Maggie McNeill
You might be right that prostitutes in general even street walkers have lower venereal disease rates than the general population at large even where prostitution is illegal. I haven’t seen the statistics. I also agree that a true professional prostitute would try very hard to remain disease free whether the governement is breathing down her back or not or whether it’s legal or not. My comments are meant to encourage legalizing prostitution.
I guess you didn’t see the link to my June 24th column above, so here it is again: Streetwalkers have venereal disease rates half that of promiscuous amateurs, and escorts’ rates are a tiny fraction of those of streetwalkers.
@ Maggie McNeill
I agree again. Even Street Walkers are safer. Obviously, you know more about prostitution in general and American prostitution specificly than I do. I confess that I know more about South Korean prostitution than American prostitution because before I joined the Army I was an English teacher in South Korea for almost 5 years. The Army also sent me to Korea for 3 years. My Korean male students tried unsuccessfully to buy me prostitutes. One of the reasons I declined their offer is that most Korean schools would fire their teachers if it was discovered they payed prostitutes. Prostitution is technically speaking has been illegal in South Korea for decades. Prostitution is by far more widespread in South Korea at least when I left 5 years ago than it has ever been the USA in my lifetime, and it probably is still more widespread. However, up until recently it was de facto ignored and allowed to run as though it was legal. It only made prostitution more expensive, dangerous and disease ridden for both the prostitutes and the customers with an added lunacy of more criminal gangster and police involvement when the prostitution laws were more vigorously enforced in South Korea. I remember telling my fellow soldiers in Korea that I’d rather stick my bare Dick in a whore in Korea as I was less likely to end up with a venereal disease than doing so in a typical Army woman. I have nothing against Army women and would have felt bad if I didn’t take a bullet for them, but statistically male soldiers were by far more likely to catch venereal diseases from female soldiers than prostitutes while I was in Korea. Despite this, the U.S.8th Army in Korea under General Duporte vigorously enforced anti-prostitution laws unlike before he took the helm. One civilian contracter told me General LaPorte prayed in church every day and at least 3 times on Sunday just to make sure. I often said out loud that it would make more sense to outlaw American male soldiers from having sex with female soldiers and let the male soldiers have sex with prostitutes. Most male soldiers laughed and agreed with me. I didn’t find out until later that even fornication was technicaly speaking against the U.S. Uniform Code of Military Justice, UCMJ, which are the U.S. military laws, but fornication is unenforced these days. The crazy part is if soldiers fornicate with eachother or civilians and there is a pregnancy, the Army will pay child support to the parents which costs the Army money. My attitude about prostitution and the military is at minimum it should be unenforced as long as the soldier doesn’t catch a venereal disease. The military won’t even punish a soldier if he catches HIV-AIDS from a non-prostitute person, but will punish him if he is discovered to have sex after being identified as HIV-AIDS positive.The military can punish a soldier for catching a sunburn because it is technically destruction of government property under UCMJ. It would be better if anti-prostitution regulations were removed from UCMJ. To be honest most female soldiers I knew were the sluttiest women I ever met in my life, and they were also much more likely to be anti-prostitution on average.than male soldiers. I remember one slutty female soldier going on about how disgusting men are for going to prostitutes and how disgusting the prostitutes are. I told her that I respected the prostitutes more than sluts because at least they were physically prettier than your typical woman civilian or certainly Army women, they were less likely to be diseased than your typical civilian woman and your typical Army woman, and at the very least the prostitutes picked up money for what they did unlike the sluts. The prostitutes also wouldn’t try to file unjustified sexual harrassment charges against the men either unlike the sluts nor would they try to fraternize with the higher ranks and try to fuck their way into getting higher rank unlike many Army women. I’d say the prostitutes were in some ways more honest than “regular” women. I’ve had Korean War veterans ask me why as an Iraq and Afghan War veteran so many Iraq and Afghan Veterans have more negative views of women. I’d respond with the things I’ve said in this commentary and previous commentaries on this post and previous posts of yours. I’ve told these men that my fellow male soldiers on average would have been better off and had more positive views of women had they only had sex with prostitutes and only civilian women and never served in the military with women as well as never gotten married to either civilian or military women.
Would everyone please observe some simple commenting etiquette, and consider doing the following three things?
1. Avoid double (or triple or quadruple) posts in a row – make your point(s) in a single comment;
2. Use the return key – i.e., paragraphs are infinitely easier to read than a wall of text;
3. Edit your comments down to less than the length of War & Peace.
When dealing with someone who has specialized knowledge of subjects under discussion, a little humility might also help.
Seriously, doclove, your comments here are three times as long as Maggie’s post! Some perspective, please.
Just skim or skip what you don’t like the formatting of or do not have time to read.
Some people do not think or compose in the same way as others, but it is still important that they be able to contribute their thoughts without being ridiculed for it.
Not everyone is a blog comment pro, but the key is getting involved, and trying to learn and relate to the topics at hand, so let’s not discourage that. Let’s make everyone feel welcome, and we will have more honest and articulate opinions.
I do understand what you mean though, but that wasn’t very nice.
BTW- typewriters have return keys. In Keyboarding, it’s called enter.
doclove is a troll, and some of those who reply endlessly to him may be, too.
I think these are reasonable guidelines. I wouldn’t say that somebody should be banned for not following them, or even that a single post should be deleted over it, but if you want people to actually read what you write, and to take it seriously, then yes, these are some damn fine suggestions.
And breaking things up into paragraphs is pretty easy.
>explained Sergeant Craig Friesen, head of Anaheim’s vice unit. ”You’d go out, arrest the girls, you do John stings, you arrest the Johns, but with those arrests they’re often low-grade misdemeanor arrests where the people either receive a very minimal sentence or they’re released, oftentimes working in the street 24 hours later. “With us changing our focus to trying to arrest the pimps, pimping carries a three year mandatory sentence here in California
Does everyone see where this is going? Cops are going to get tired of only busted one pimp per year, and are going to find it difficult to justify the budget. Sooner or later, they are going to try charging some of the women with “pimping” themselves, or even with “trafficking” themselves.
After all, an independent escort performs all the functions of a “pimp” herself- arranges the appointments, looks after her own protection. In no time, we’re going to see them use this law to lock up hookers for three years. And if and when the women ever do want to retire, try getting a straight job with that kind of record.
The whole “greedy” vs. “lazy” point Maggie mentions intrigues me. I can’t say my motivation for leaving working for a service was greed. I just liked running my own show. But then, my “leaving” was sort of odd. I actually continued to see a few clients through the agency even after I went independent. I had a good relationship with the man who owned the agency, and he trusted me not to cheat him. Plus, I must say, he had more difficulty replacing me as his “rough sex” girl than he thought. Some of his clients demanded me only. It worked out, and it made a smooth transition to independent.
Well, they’re strong and slightly exaggerated words. But yes, independence is also a strong motivator for working for oneself.
Perhaps I should have used the term “married” or “emotionally attached” women – instead of “straight women”? 😛
Laura, I realize that there are women out there like you – who can separate sex from love – and who may have the maturity to realize that men are wired differently and are driven to have sex for simply it’s own sake.
However, I’ve dated quite a few women and there was only ONE that even comes close to being that enlightened.
And SHE … was an enigma all to her own. She once told me that when I was in the Philippines I could have sex with anyone – but NOT in Australia. When I asked her why … she told me … “Because I know it’s just a physical thing if you have sex with a Filipino woman – but with an Australian – there’s a possibility you’ll fall in love with her.”
LOL
Just out of curiosity, was there any truth to that?
I once had a dirt bag boss – he was a dirt bag for more than just his sexual behavior – whose wife said he could have anal sex with anyone, just no vaginal sex.
I don’t know whether the limitation was to protect family assets against paternity issues or to let him go elsewhere for what she didn’t want to do, or both.
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