I’m a retired escort who, like you, married her favorite client. From the beginning I made it clear that sleeping with other women was okay, but secrecy, lies, and emotional engagements were not; I also requested that any sex outside of our relationship be with professionals rather than amateurs. We have a very active sex life, and every few months I’ve reminded him that he could see escorts if he wished as long as he told me about it (just the fact that he did, not the details). He’s always said that he hasn’t, but recently I accidentally stumbled across evidence that he’s had many appointments since we’ve been together; I also found email exchanges with his ex including plans to get together. I feel terrible for bringing this all on, but I also feel betrayed, hurt, and upset that he would lie to me. Am I wrong for feeling this way when I gave him permission to see escorts? Is it worth talking to him about? Am I being naive or silly?
First of all, feelings are never “wrong” or “silly”. Humans are emotional creatures, and can’t help what we feel; we can only control how we act upon those feelings. Nor do I think you were being naive; in fact, quite the opposite. As a sex worker yourself you know how men are, and you did everything you could to circumvent the possibility that he would hurt you by deception; not only did you give him permission to see others, you were even careful to re-iterate that permission a number of times. The fact that he completely ignored your very simple and reasonable requirement – that he let you know whenever he did see another lady – is, I think, more than adequate reason to feel betrayed and hurt. You gave him an outlet to be physical with other women, but instead he chose to act in a way that feels to you like emotional infidelity; I’m sure I would feel just as betrayed and hurt if I were in your situation.
There are several reasons why a man might cheat on his wife, and as I discussed in “Preventative Measures” only some of them can be prevented by things the wife might do (such as taking care of him at home and allowing him “strange” in controlled circumstances). I suspect this passage applies to your husband: “if it’s the illicit nature of trysts with hookers which turns him on, that’s going to present a problem; if he craves sneaking around behind his wife’s back, he’s not likely to be satisfied with activities she attends, arranges or even simply condones.” Think back to when he was your client; did it seem that “sneaking around” to see you turned him on? Because that’s what his behavior seems to point to. Only he can say whether he has emotional feelings for anyone he’s seen (like his ex), but secrecy? Check. Lies? Check. Amateurs? Check. It’s as though he was purposefully breaking as many of the rules you set as possible; perhaps that in itself gives him a thrill.
I definitely think you need to talk to him about this; try to remain as calm and reasonable as you can manage, and explain to him how you found out and why you’re hurt. Don’t let him derail you by accusing you of spying on him; you were acting in good faith and even if it what you did were wrong, his sins are far greater. Also, don’t let him pretend he really believed his behavior was OK; unless he’s remarkably stupid I think it’s pretty clear that he knew he was breaking the rules. Unfortunately, I can’t give you any advice about what happens next; there’s no way to know how he will react, what he will say, and how you will feel about his reactions. I also can’t tell you whether it would be “right” to stay with a man who behaved like this, or whether you “should” leave him. But I will say this: I can virtually guarantee that this will happen again, probably repeatedly, no matter what he tells you. So your decision about the future of the relationship needs to take that into account.
(Have a question of your own? Please consult this page to see if I’ve answered it in a previous column, and if not just click here to ask me via email.)
Hmm, maybe you need to make an arrangement with the ex.
For five years he lives with you and pays for sex with her then you swap …
Or maybe you should make plans with the ex to both take revenge on him for his betrayal, like in one of Maggie’s stories.
Great, down-to-earth and reasonable advice Maggie!
Some guys just don’t appreciate how good they’ve got it. Most guys could only dream of having a wife who would let them have sex with other women. I heard this same sort of story from a local escort who let her husband see other women. He wasn’t satisfied unless he could sneak behind her back.
Okay well …
It’s NOT all in the sex.
And shit, I don’t know how to explain it – but I’m sure I’ll make a lousy attempt at doing so.
There are a few elements to an “affair” aside from sex. The first is probably that original feeling of “love” a man experiences when he finds a girl that turns him on in EVERY way – not just in a sexual way. And – that feeling gets amplified if the girl reciprocates the emotion. This is some heavy shit to deal with – because it’s like a drug to some men and yes, I’m speaking from experience.
The “other woman” has the advantage though – because she’s new … and unknown. You spend a few years with a chick – like you certainly do when you’re married – and you know everything about her (and she you). After awhile – there are really no more “stories” you can tell each other. The other thing is … all the little things that kind of annoyed you about your wife, but you were willing to overlook them early on when you were in a stage of “druglike” love – those things then start to get on your nerves over time when the “drug” state wears off. Sometimes they REALLY get on your nerves. When you’re with the other woman – suddenly you can spend days talking to her – and she doesn’t get on your nerves. And even though you’re a “metal” guy – you can slow dance for hours with her to her favorite music, THE CARPENTERS – even though you HATE the fucking CARPENTERS. It doesn’t matter … all of a sudden you find yourself downloading them off of iTunes – because listening to them in your truck makes you think of her.
Further – since the “other woman” doesn’t know you either, you get a “mulligan”. You can try to correct every bad habit you have … try to be the man you think she wants you to be. You’ve already had a relationship with your wife for a long time … made some screw-ups … and you’re not going to redeem them.
But with a new girl you have a “blank slate”. And you think (at least) that you can make it better with her – perfect with her.
Other elements …
Some men don’t like to be “caged” by a set of rules. I just sat here thinking … if I was married to a woman who told me I could see other chicks – but then there were all these laboratory restrictions on it … it would kind of kill the thrill. You can throw a ribeye steak to a caged Lion – and yeah, he’ll eat it … but he won’t be as happy as if he’s out on the range … hunting down his own dinner, on his own terms.
So there’s that too.
Another thing is the element of “danger”. He’s going behind her back, and boy he will be in the shits if she finds out. This is the kind of challenge that can be thrilling.
I know everyone likes to think that men are all 12″ of forged-pipe boner – and any “hole” should do … but it’s A LOT more complicated than that. I really wish I only thought of women as “conquests” – and for a lot of women – you can but … I can’t fucking explain it – but every now and then you run into one that is like some Marvel comics super-heroine, and she has some hidden skill to really get into your mind and turn into a soup sandwich.
And … it’s like … YOU KNOW what is happening when she does it – and part of you is telling you … “You dumbass – get out of this now – she’s a CHICK, that’s all”
But then another part of you – which is the part that, for some reason, you feel inclined to listen to … says … “Yeah, I’m enslaved by her … isn’t it just fucking AWESOME?”
If any of that makes sense.
“Some men don’t like to be “caged” by a set of rules. I just sat here thinking … if I was married to a woman who told me I could see other chicks – but then there were all these laboratory restrictions on it … it would kind of kill the thrill.”
Absolutely, and not only men either. If you put some children in a room with all manner of toys/entertainments and you told them to not touch the small red button in the corner, what would happen? You know at least one of the brats would run over there and hammer on the red button.
No matter how reasonable the rule, someone will break it.
I think your comment is spot on. This woman gave her man the right to see others and he still cheated!? Not being a woman, I guess I didn’t realize how right Maggie McNeill was when she mentioned some men just want to sneak around. I don’t have any desire for cloak and dagger behind a partner’s back, so this seems so bizarre. This man really doesn’t appreciate a good think and it sounds like a good woman.
Most women would not be 100% cool with a guy stepping out no matter how many times they say they are, so the husband was taking the best approach available, though of course that way was also a trap.
Most women are not retired escorts. And seeing amateurs would NEVER be the “best way available” even if the rest of your statement really were true, which it isn’t.
Agreed, amateurs are not “the best way available.”
But there’s also something else: as you have pointed out before, escorts and retired escorts are not hugely different from women in the general population.
I remember seeing (on a local discussion forum, run and moderated by a local working escort) some posts by a visiting escort who — I eventually came to find out — had a HUGE amount of anger about clients who were married men. She would accept them as clients, but she felt that they were miserable excuses for human beings. Because they were married and were “adulterers.”
She knew her own feelings well enough that, if she ever did retire with a favorite client, she would probably never give him the option that your questioner gave *her* husband.
But would every escort know herself that well, and be as straightforward?
Would every *woman* know herself that well, and be as straightforward?
It seems to me that — if escorts (active and retired) are not hugely different from women in the general population, then shouldn’t some escorts be as skittish and uncertain as some women are in the general population?
Clearly, your questioner is not.
Is it just as clear that her husband feels certain that she is not?
It has been said that the three most important things in ethical non monogamy are “communication,” “communication,” and “communication.”
If he thought that he could not take her assurances at face value … then perhaps he and she failed to have effective communication about the matter.
I can say, from my own experience, that one of the hardest obstacles in such communication is the fear that the other person does not really mean the positive-sounding things they are saying.
Was this lady a genuine escort … or someone who advertised herself as “FBSM”? Just a wild-assed stab in the dark on my part – but I have found a lot of “FBSM” gals to be REALLY conflicted about shit like this.
Not FBSM. She was definitely a “full service” gal.
There ARE some women who are okay with “stepping out” – but it’s usually under controlled circumstances. I dated an escort – it was okay with her for me see other escorts … like the girls she worked with. She even encouraged it. I also dated an amateur girl who told me, that when I was on deployment – I could have any Asian woman I wanted … because she had figured out that I only fall “in love” with white chicks. So the Philippines were green-light “sin city” … but Australia? Better stay on the boat, boy.
These girls want to make sure they keep your “heart” … even though they’re willing to “share” your body. I understand this inclination.
Exactly what I though.
In my heart of hearts I cannot believe that anyone was truly okay with his/her partner seeing others, no matter the rules. As long as the couple’s sexual life is okay this would always feel to me like either a psychological thing (like the guys who get off on ‘giving their wives away to strangers’) or about power.
By power I mean that the partner who allows affairs is admitting that he needs the relationship more and is therefore ready to make sacrifices.
Even if my gf allowed me to see others – whatever the rules – I would always assume that the actual act would hurt her (all the more when some of the rules are ‘we don’t talk about specifics’).
Thus: faithfulness > secret cheating > admitting cheating.
The one thing that *is* truly bad here is the thing with his Ex. This is just a no-no always.
I don’t think her situation is any different, really, from any other wife who finds herself in this situation.
I don’t think she should blame herself, certainly.
Another possibility might be … that he didn’t believe her reassurances that extra-marital sex would be “OK” under certain circumstances.
I can hear him thinking:
“She *says* that it would be OK. Does she really *mean* it? Or is this actually a ‘test’ she is posing … to see whether I would take her up on on that offer and show her that I am actually a ‘bad husband’?”
(There are stories of tests such as these … starting perhaps with Herodotus as he “explained” why the Persians chose to make war on the Greeks. We learn a lot of our social behavior from stories … including some of our self-destructive behavior.)
“And if it’s a test … she’s gonna blow up on me, oh gawd. Is this something I want to take at face value?”
I don’t know him of course; I can’t read his mind. Just saying that there are men out there who don’t feel that they know when a woman’s promise is solid — especially when it’s an unconventional promise about her understanding of “sexual fidelity.”
Yeah – there’s a little of that going on too sometimes. With my “free” girlfriend who gave me permission to run amok with Asians … if I did do it – I never told her … didn’t know how she’d react.
I remember telling her … “Thanks for the hall pass, but you are the only woman on the planet I want.”
That was a lie, obviously.
Other lies? “Babe I will love you forever. Even if something happens and you can’t have sex with me ever again … I will stay by you until the end and be happy … I will masturbate in shower for the rest of my life thinking of you when I do it.”
LOL 😀
This post prompted a question for me. I looked in the archives you posted and while I found similar topics none of them quite addressed something I’ve wondered about.
Do many escorts have contempt for married men who used their services? Do you? Or do escorts tend to harbor more sympathetic views of male infidelity. Obviously this is going to vary widely from person to person.
I want to get married one day. I also enjoy the occasional p4p ( probably about 20 percent of my romantic activity), but I can give it up I think.
I really, really get turned off by the idea that the woman in question secretly loathes me.
Just throwing this out there in case anyone has any knowledge.
As the one who brought that subject up … I wouldn’t expect any given escort to have *any* specific opinion on the subject. I simply mentioned to show that I would expect to see a range of opinions among escorts, on that subject.
Just as we might expect a range of opinions among women-in-general, on the subject of men not married to *them* who were having extra-marital sex.
I wouldn’t say that kind of attitude was common. Obviously, I don’t feel that way; in fact, I’m rather surprised that you asked.
It is hard for me not to judge harshly those who feel the need to limit a mate’s other friends and/or sex partners. There seems no possible motive except control-freak-ism.
One would think a former professional (many of whose clients must have been “cheating” as their wives would view it) would especially be above feeling that way. Or is it one of those gut-level reactions that the mind can’t defeat?
Well, the restrictions described here seem to be quite reasonable and a hell of lot more open than most women would set (that being “no other women, period”). What the restrictions describe mean is “you can cheat in body, but not in mind”. As Maggie said, escorts don’t want to steal their clients from their wives, which is why they’re safer for a woman who wants to keep her husband.