There’s a woman who often comes into my workplace. She has let me know she’s very interested and I think she’s gorgeous. However, I know she’s hesitant to do anything with me because I’m married, and it wouldn’t be right for me just to “nail her” and leave her hanging because she really needs a man. She’s a single mom who just lost her job a few months ago, so she’s having some financial problems. So what if I approach her and offer her some compensation? I’d pay her just like any other escort (and I pay well); all she’d really have to do is spend 3 or 4 hours with me at dinner and her place and I know she already would like to do that. She’s definitely no prude; she always talks and jokes very candidly. So I don’t think she’ll be offended if I make the offer – but I’m not too sure. Is a good idea?
In a word: no. Most amateur women are so brainwashed into seeing sex work as “dirty” and “bad” that they will instantly and stupidly perceive the offer of money as an insult, even if they see the request that they give it up for free as a reasonable one. Take a look at some of the mental gymnastics halfway whores perform in order to avoid admitting the truth; Cirque du Soleil has nothing on these gals. Nor is it ever a good idea for a married man to become involved with an amateur, especially not one who’s attracted to him and “needs” a man, because those are exactly the characteristics that will drive her to cause trouble. I’m sure it’s a great boost to your ego for a hot chick to come on to you, but emotional involvement is inevitably a spanner in the spokes of extramarital activity unless you actually want a divorce. Women who only want small amounts of money in exchange for small amounts of sex are safe partners for a married man; those who want love, fun, companionship or a lifetime of support are disasters waiting to happen.
The only way this could possibly work is if she turns pro. You could try bringing up the subject half-jokingly, telling her that she really ought to consider escorting in order to make ends meet; if she seems offended just blow it off as an idle suggestion, ending with something like “I don’t see anything wrong with a woman using her natural abilities to prosper.” Then never bring it up again, and give up on the whole idea of boinking her. If, on the other hand, she seems intrigued, point her to this website; there are plenty of mentoring posts she can read to help her decide. You absolutely do not want her to think that you’re offering to be her pimp or anything like that, and if she gets that idea anyway and seems open to it, you need to insist that she do it on her own (see the last sentence of the preceding paragraph). If she takes up sex work on her own and then offers you a compensated date without any hinting on your part, it’s a horse of a different color from your offering her money outright; though you still need to be extremely careful since you know she’s attracted to you, the fact that she’s doing sex work will show you she at least has the ability to view the situation pragmatically, and the money will provide a buffer. Furthermore, if she’s hooking and you know it, you have a secret to counterbalance her knowledge of your infidelity. You may call that calculus cold-blooded if you like; I prefer the word “realistic”.
(Have a question of your own? Please consult this page to see if I’ve answered it in a previous column, and if not just click here to ask me via email.)
That advice sounds spot on to me.
Presumably the questioner knows the woman involved well enough to have some idea as to how she might react to a suggestion that she tries sex work, but a couple of things I’d consider with most of the women I have known who could be in a similar situation.
1) Make the suggestion ‘third person’. Not “Have you considered sex work?” so much as “A woman as attractive/sharp/empathetic as yourself could easily balance the budget with a little bit of escort work”. Even better would be if you could discuss an escort you know “A lady I know called Sally was in a similar position to yourself and is now doing quite well as an escort”.
2) If you’re going to do it ‘jokingly’ don’t force the jokes without considering the audience. “Escorts sure know how to make ends meet” or “You could be sitting on a fortune” are not going to go down well with everyone.
Gah. No. Just no. Give her a gift of money (call it a loan) OR sleep with her. For sure, not both.
Well, she could take a loan out from anyone, couldn’t she? And she’d have to pay it back. And sleeping her without giving her anything – well that’s a shitty deal for her too isn’t it?
Although I totally agree with Maggie – it sucks that this kind of an arrangement wouldn’t work. For instance, let’s say the gal is looking for a permanent companion – but hasn’t found one yet – and she still needs some kind of financial support. What would be wrong with her getting payment for sleeping with a married man that she’s attracted to? As long as she had the self discipline to keep it discreet and not demand that it proceed to anything beyond that?
A lot of gals won’t get into “pay sex” simply because they are unable to get over having sex with a guy that they are either not attracted to – or are kind of turned off by. So there COULD be a “gray market” area (if women had the discipline) for them to have sex for pay with a willing guy they are attracted to.
LOL – I think this is actually the whole point of “Full Body Sensual Massage” – those girls promise only a happy ending – but if you get on the table and they’re attracted to you – then you get one hell of a lot more than a hand job!! I believe those girls use the guise of “FBSM” to screen for potential clients that they’d have no problem fucking.
I think that women are a prize – and men should sacrifice something in order to be with them. Either commitment or some other kind of compensation.
Got off work at the bar early the other night and these three chicks in their 20’s asked me come “hang out” with them, so I did – for a couple hours (one of them is now my dentist! LOL – she has HUGE tits so I’m looking forward to having those babies right in my face during my next root canal!) – anyway – they were lamenting the fact that “Guys these days only want one thing” … but “Krulac The Wise” told them … “That’s the way it’s always been – the problem is – most girls these days don’t put a PRICE on that one thing – they give it away for free.”
And that’s really it. Guys treat girls like a commodity these days because women – as a whole – act like they are a commodity, and a cheap one too!
And it’s sad too … because I believe that how good or bad men are – is dependent upon the demands that women place on them. If women have high expectations for men – they’ll meet them. If they have low ones – then men will do the minimum and meet those too!
Women, as a whole – really fucking don’t understand how important they are to men – and to the whole dynamic of human society. Fuck – I would not work one fucking day if it weren’t for the women in my life holding out their hands and needing money – and I’m glad to give it – for what I get back from them. It may sound stupid and yeah – I’m a slave to those big batting eyes and that little wonderful box they have and the whole world makes sense to me and I don’t even give a shit that they’re controlling me with so little effort. It’s why I work seven days a week – more money – more girls – very simple equation.
This is why I consider call girls, escorts, hookers – whatever you want to call them – the most enlightened women on the planet. They UNDERSTAND the male / female dynamic – and realize that they are WORTH SOMETHING to men.
But “free” women – nope – they don’t get it.
Shame.
So I guess you’re flat out scoffing soda and boiled lollies as you type?
Well, she could take a loan out from anyone, couldn’t she? And she’d have to pay it back. And sleeping her without giving her anything – well that’s a shitty deal for her too isn’t it?
I was just trying to emphasize what a bad idea it was to offer her money for sex. It was hypothetical. I wasn’t ACTUALLY actually saying he should do either/or.
My judgmental opinion? Leave her alone.
“Boiled lollies”= hard candy.
😀
You just earned yourself a bag of hard candies as translator’s fees when we meet up, Sasha.
See my response to PWW below. 🙂
Yeah I wasn’t dogging you out there Sasha, I was just pointing out that making $1,000 and paying it with sex seems smarter to me than getting it through a loan.
But I agree with you – that guy should leave her alone – hopefully he’s strong enough to do that!
(but you know guys!)
It is – and I think it should be. It’s a lot harder for MEN to turn on women visually – or with just our physical presence than it is for women to turn on men that way.
So when a girl flashes those eyes at you that tell you “it’s okay” for you to approach her … yeah, it’s a damn good feeling. I feel like muthafarking Conan the Barbarian when it happens.
Hey Krulac, speaking of hypotheticals…
If a random guy started staring closely at your prepubescent daughter while she was splashing about under a sprinkler or in a pool, and he fended off your disapproving comments by saying, “Oh it’s nothing, I’m just looking for signs of spontaneous clitoral erection.”
…how would you feel about that?
I’d put the guy in a coma – do not pass go, do not collect $200. 😀
I’m talking about a grown woman though – and grown women don’t (normally) come up to the guy and say … “Hey, I like you!”. Normally what you get from a girl is a look – and in my experience – it’s usually not with a big grin but something more serious, or a bit devious or naughty – she might cock her mouth to one side or pucker her lips – every girl is different. She kind of tilts her head down a notch – stares right into your eyes as if she’s trying to do some mental telepathy with you.
What she’s saying is … “You passed the first test – care to take the next one?” The next one being … “Are you brave and confident enough to approach me?” That’s a critical test for her – because your looks are secondary to a girl – it’s the attitude that counts with them. This is the test that most guys fail – every beta male will fail it – because they hesitate or start to doubt what the “look” really means. They can’t believe it means what it does. So they hesitate – and it’s apparent – and they fail the test and then go off and bitch about how women only go for alpha guys. Actually – women go for the guys who pass their tests – alpha or not.
If you can muster up 20 seconds of courage and go right for her without hesitating – and then say something witty or smart that is appropriate and feels comfortable under the circumstances – the rest is all downhill – you got her.
Not all women know how to do “the look”. Just like there are men who aren’t confident – there’s women who aren’t also – and they’re fearful of shooting you “the look”. They’ll be real geeky or glance at you when they think you won’t see them. They fare better than beta guys though – because a guy who’s smart can recognize what kind of girl she is and approach her anyway – with the same kind of approach as you use on the more confident girls.
I’m not talking about a grown woman. Hypothetical situation involves a child under 10.
Notwithstanding, I don’t think it would work on many grown women either. 😛
I can’t tell if a grown woman’s clitoris is erect even when she’s naked – so I don’t think if she even had the faintest amount of clothing on – that I would have a chance in hell of seeing it.
Fantasy #121, out of the Submarine Pervert’s Handbook involves a race of alien women with clitoris’ that are two feet long and can be manipulated like a tentacle – and they do amazing things with that tentacle – like wrap it many times around a certain male body part and squeeze and stroke. And when you slip “out” they use the tentacle to reinsert.
You can definitely tell when these alien women are aroused.
Believe me krulac, no matter how keen they are to go down on something long and hard and full of seamen, submarine perverts haven’t got a patch on the guy Sasha is talking about.
Okay – now I GET what you were talking about!
Clitoral erections in women. My opinion? Having been with a few … is that some women get pronounced erections while some don’t get any. I’ve never known many women who just “spontaneously” erected – usually the “erection” came as the result of stimulation (and in my case, that stimulation had to be oral – I can feel what the clitoris is doing with my tongue – but the ends of my fingertips are so rough I can’t tell when I’m using my hands).
And I don’t think that clitoral response is always the same in a woman throughout her life. For instance – prior to menopause – my wife’s clit was so sensitive I had to spend at least ten annoying minutes very lightly licking or breathing on it before I could really do anything meaningful. When she was in her 20’s – her clit would erect up to the point of orgasm … I could almost “gauge” when she was going to have one just based on this … and then it would quickly deflate a split second before she came.
After menopause – she is not nearly as sensitive there and I can get to work immediately. She’s A LOT more into penetration – which that was her primary stimulation anyway – even before but now she can’t get enough.
Clitoral erections are overblown. The female sexual response is a lot different from men – way more complicated. I bet if Maggie were honest she’d say that sexually satisfying a man is easier for her than satisfying a woman is – even though Maggie is a woman and should know EVERYTHING about female sexual response – but she doesn’t … because they’re all different!
The clitoris is like a male “leftover” on a female body right? Well – it’s not going to be the same as a penis. Just like nipples on men. A lot of girls I knew LOVED having their nipples stroked – and if they were on the verge of an orgasm – in many cases all I had to do was start lightly rubbing on their nipples and they’d be over that cliff QUICKO!!!
Conversely – my nipples are about as dead as stump. Girls will spend all kinds of time on them playing with them and I’m like … “Uhm really?” … I have something more fun they could play with because nipple stimulation is nothing but annoying to me.
My thoughts exactly, krulac.
Though of course I was raised proper and keep thoughts like that to myself.
I have some advice for the girl in this scenario: Run away from this guy.
One thing that I think was lost in my condensation of the reader’s letter is that this woman is really coming on hard to him, using the sort of schoolgirl “seduction” I would’ve considered embarrassingly unsubtle when I was 15. So she’s not about to “run away”, and in fact may need to be forcibly diverted.
Ah, ok. It still seems like they have completely different expectations of what they want.
I wouldn’t even suggest it jokingly. I’d approach the issue a little more sideways, with a more generalized comment on a recent news story or something so you can suss out her attitude toward sex work.
I think it’s a terrible idea to discuss sex-for-money in a workplace setting in any way. Talk about sexual harassment bait. The questioner is trying to frame his cheating as a “good deed”, which it simply can’t be in a typical marriage
I figure since it is close enough to the holiday season and if she really is having a difficult time, a Target gift card and just say that it is to make the upcoming holidays easier for her and her children. Call it a Santa gift or whatever, but just emphasize it is an exchange from one concerned human being to another.
And leave the sex alone in this case. Warning: Danger Ahead.
Forget her and move on. The amount of trouble you are staring at is not worth the orgasm you think you’re going to have. You are married. Stick with the discreet pros.
I would have an ethical problem with steering a woman towards escorting and cashing in on her financial misfortune. I personally would much rather be in a sexual/financial relationship with one man that I enjoy and am attracted to. What everybody here has failed to mention here is that escorts also have to lie beneath many men who are not attractive in any way and not all of us cope that well with it.
If there is a common attraction, why don’t you gently explain that you love your wife and you’re never going to leave but you are looking for a no strings sexual arrangement? Then separately tell her that you would like to offer her a monthly stipend for clothing and expenses. Tell her that you know she’s struggling but a woman has needs and you would like to help. Be generous but make like it’s not a big deal and don’t guilt trip her like she owes you something because of your help. Be completely transparent. She must understand that you will never leave your wife under any circumstances.
If she blows your cover it may be a worthwhile exercise and an opportunity to iron things out with your wife. Marriage is a compromise and clearly there is a shortfall in your wife’s sexual enthusiasm. I find that many of my client’s wives are happy to turn a blind eye to their husbands indiscretions so long as they are kept in the manner to which they are accustomed and not forced to confront the truth.
Sometimes making yourself a little vulnerable can be beneficial to all parties, it can also go horribly wrong. It’s up to you to decide if you can trust this girl.
I have to agree with Maggie’s basic advice here: Don’t do it man.
I keep hoping and praying you’ll never get into the ###*** pushed about non-whore women. You haven’t since I met you (thank God) but I do have fears about it sometimes, i.e. you hear and see the ###*** long enough it’ll become OK to you.
I can understand that sort of fear.
GGGGGRRRR! OK…that WAS a funny reply…smile.